User Tools

Site Tools


australia:tents_hot

hot tents (tents with wood stoves inside)

Introduction

  • these are particularly popular in the Nth Hemisphere for camping in sub-zero / snow conditions
  • they need have an opening “stove jack” for a chimney flue which has fire resistant flashing
  • the chimney flue will need to have a double or triple shield to reduce risk of nearby tent material burning
  • there must be adequate ventilation at all times and you should have a carbon monoxide alarm as an extra precaution
  • although polycotton material is at least 40% heavier than nylon, it has significant advantages for a hot tent in snow:
    • more fire retardant
    • easier to repair by stitching
    • more breathable with reduced hoarfrost building up on the inside
  • a Nordic tipi style is perhaps the best for hot tent in the snow or on polar ice sheets:
    • easier to set up in strong winds as you peg it down first before there is any need to elevate it
    • steep sides allow snow to fall off
    • allows centrally placed stove away from tent wall and stove jack is higher and thus less hot
    • more resistant to changes in wind directions than most other designs apart from geodesic
    • central height allows standing
    • gear can be stored around the edges and sleeping mats towards the middle
    • wet gear can be hung from the top sections of the centre pole to dry out over the stove
    • has a nicer ambience than most other tent designs which can be very important psychologically
    • most allow a 2P tent to be able to be set up inside if desired
    • these are popular for glamping as they add some extra amenity to the tipi style
    • essentially they are tipi tents sitting on vertical canvas walls
    • the vertical walls allow:
      • extra standing head space
      • better use of the peripheral otherwise angled part as the tipi hits the ground
      • they generally incorporate meshed windows for added ventilation options and ground level visibility
  • Large floorless dome-like or tunnel tents
  • you are probably not going to get to go snow camping with a stove in Australia but a hot tent can be awesome still:
    • when temperatures fall below 10 deg C
      • no floor needed and most probably won't need to use a insect protecting mesh inner tent as there are few insects around
    • in cool/cold conditions, especially with prolonged persistent rain
      • stove makes a great option then for keeping warm, drying out clothes, boiling water for hot showers, and for cooking and hopefully you have a tent at least 4m diameter and 2m tall to allow some amenity
      • you will need a inner mesh tent with waterproof tub floor, or, a stretcher bed to keep you off the wet ground
    • if you love to cook inside the tent despite poor weather
  • if you have kids or pets in your tent you may prefer safer methods of keeping warm when camping or hiking
  • pros
    • sheltered space to cook when its windy and cold
    • security - stove is less likely to be stolen if its inside the tent
    • ability to dry off wet clothes, boots
    • makes camping in prolonged rain or long cold nights more enjoyable
    • solo trip where you want to read a book in winter is more enjoyable
    • air you breathe is warmer - if you wake up to keep the fire going all night
    • cooking in a chimney oven is fairly easy once you get used to maintaining the fire
    • don't need to use your gas supply to cook or boil water
    • you don't need to go out in the rain or wind to tend to the camp fire
    • you burn much less wood than a camp fire
    • it is far better controlled and goes cold much quicker than a camp fire allowing you to get to sleep without having to worry it will flare up during the night
    • much less likely to cause a bushfire (as long as your tent doesn't catch fire!)
  • cons
    • wood stoves for camping do need a supply of small dry seasoned wood and need to be stoked every half an hour or so thus not for keeping warm whilst sleeping
    • the tents and stove are substantially heavier than cold tenting - but not so bad if car camping or you have a sled on snow
    • they are a lot more work than cold tenting especially in setting up:
      • site selection, flat level stove site so chimney is vertical, and if on snow, the snow will melt
      • gathering and cutting fire wood into smaller than usual sizes
      • stove requires constant attention and babysitting - you need to add wood every 30-45 minutes
    • they are more expensive than cold tenting
    • risk of fire and carbon monoxide - you should have a carbon monoxide alarm

Risks of a stove inside a tent

  • carbon monoxide poisoning
    • stove must be enclosed with a chimney that exits the tent however even with this, a strong wind or a blocked chimney may result in carbon monoxide entering the tent
      • keep your chimney pipes clean inside to remove any creosote build up
      • keep chimney damper fully open
      • preferably one person should remain awake at all times to keep watch
    • the tent MUST be well ventilated (ie. open windows or doors)
    • you should preferably have a carbon monoxide alarm in the tent
  • tent catches on fire
    • this should not happen with a:
      • proper stove properly fitted to the tent with triple wall chimney pipes, etc
      • tent should of the design such that the stove is well away from the tent walls - a teepee style tent with a central stove is the optimum for this and also allows the stove jack to be at a higher position with a somewhat cooler chimney segment passing through
      • stove sitting on a large enough fireproof blanket, or preferably on bare ground - the tent should NOT have a floor under the stove
      • care not to knock it over, in strong winds, guy out the chimney for extra safety
      • spark arrester securely fitted to chimney - although you still may get the occasional ember hole on your tent fly
      • stove jack should be fire retardant and adjacent tent material must not be allowed to touch a hot chimney - ensure tent is guyed out securely
    • as extra precautions:
      • have a bucket of water handy
      • don't sleep in anything that could catch on fire - semi-naked also absorbs the radiant heat better
      • choose a tent with two doors to exit from and leave them unzipped so you don't have to find a zip if tent catches fire
      • sleep with an aramid/wool fire blanket - won't catch fire, won't melt, protects from embers, can use it to wrap around you to put flames out or prevent heat injury or melting tent thermal injury
        • also can be used in your car to cover you if caught in a bush fire (stay below level of windows though)
  • 3rd degree burns from contact with the stove
    • ensure there is 1.2m walking space around the stove
    • don't get drunk
    • don't have trip hazards
    • use fireguards if children or pets are around - better still, don't have kids around
    • use heat protective gloves when accessing the stove
    • don't place stove in walking path to an exit
  • you get too hot inside the tent
    • then you get sweaty and can get cold when you put the fire out
    • commonly for a tipi tent in the snow, the ceiling air will be well over 30degC while the stove is running, consider tents with wider head spaces
  • increased condensation risk inside tent
    • once the fire is out and the temperature drops, the air is no longer able to hold the same amount of water vapour from your breathing as before and this results in condensation in tents unless you take measures against this
  • tendency to spend more time inside the tent than enjoying the outdoors with others around a campfire
  • all tents are flammable, some less so than others
    • example heat sources
      • naked flames are generally 910°C (candle), 1920°C (alcohol), 2200°C (butane)
      • a stove chimney can easily be over 300°C near the stove
      • glowing smoldering combustion (embers) may reach up to 600°C
      • an incandescent globe reaches 100-300°C
      • a tungsten halogen globe reaches 600-900°C which is the same as a lit match!
    • “fireproof mats” are designed to minimise damage from transient contact with embers but they generally do little to stop radiant heat to materials beneath if embers are not dealt with quickly
      • carbon fiber with aluminum foil can withstand up to 400°C
      • fiberglass with heat-resistant silicone coating can withstand up to 250℃
    • flammability of various materials
      • for comparison, paper ignites at 218-246degC depending on thickness, moisture content, etc (cardboard is ~426degC), and paper will spontaneously combust at ~250degC
      • certain synthetic fibers are extremely flame resistant, including glass fibers (fibreglass) and modacrylic
      • wool and silk burn slowly, are difficult to ignite (ignition point for wool is 230°C), and may self-extinguish
      • leather ignites at 212°C
      • rubber ignites at 260-316°C
      • ignition and burn factors of fabric are also affected by the weight and weave of the fabric
      • the flammability of fabric can be drastically reduced through the use of fire retardants
        • cotton can be topically treated with a chemical that reduces the fabric’s flammability to the extent that it becomes nearly non-combustible
        • polyester can be similarly treated to make it “durably fire retardant”
        • these fabrics must be dry-cleaned with a non-liquid cleaning agent and the duration of fire retardant ability depends on age and number of times dry cleaned
      • polyethylene is much more flammable than PVC or polyester
        • polyethylene melts at 85-140°C, has a flash point of 341°C and auto-ignites at 330-410°C
      • PVC starts distorting at 60°C and starts to degrade at 70°C releasing HCl, and melts at 75-110°C but ignition point is 435-557°C
      • nylon, polyester and acrylic fabrics tend to be slow to ignite but once ignited, severe melting and dripping occurs
        • acrylic melts at 91-125°C and ignites at 560°C
        • nylon melts at 160-275°C and ignites at 424-532°C depending on type of nylon
        • polyester (aka polyethylene terephthalate or PET) requires more heat to burn than most fabrics (particularly cotton or linen but also other synthetic fibers) and when it does finally burn, it usually melts and may self-extinguish
        • polyester starts to melt at 220°C (one of the highest melting points for synthetics) and tends to pull away from a heat source, it will ignite at ~440°C (eg. direct flame although it is regarded as relatively fire resistant to flames)
        • molten polyester can cause far more severe burns to the skin than a fabric that burns away
        • if polyester does burn, the fumes that it releases are likely to be toxic
        • special Trevira™ and Avora™ polyester fibers are considered inherently or permanently fire retardant
      • normal cotton fabric burns readily and can ignite quickly (ignition point 250°C), resulting in a fast moving flame spread
      • polyester-cotton is generally MORE flammable than cotton as the molten polyester tends to wick on the cotton char, resulting in the phenomenon of scaffolding and thus it may actually burn faster than either material alone unless a fire retardant is added
      • polycarbonates melt at 140-150°C and ignite at 580°C
  • if the tent does not come with a stove jack, you can install a flashing kit permanently anywhere suitable on your tent by making a large enough hole in the tent so the tent material is well away from the stove chimney, when chimney is not being used, unscrew the flashing kit and install the circular flat metal rain guard.
  • if you have a Winnerwell Nomad wood camping stoves and you want to use the pipe oven, the tent's flue opening needs to be high enough (at least 1.2m high) to accommodate this and that may require it to be more central than peripheral
  • chimney must extend at least 1m higher than the tent's flue opening and at least 60cm higher that the highest point of the tent
  • preferably, the stove must be more than 1.2m from any flammable material (1.5m clearance above the stove) and less flammable items must be more than 30cm away!
  • tent must be ventilated by at least a 0.5m2 opening (however tent must be fully open when starting fire as there will be a lot of smoke from low temperature combustion!) and air flow controller on stove must be fully open to minimise carbon monoxide re-entering tent
  • must check chimney and spark arrestor daily to ensure no creosote build up otherwise risk of chimney fire or carbon monoxide issues
  • if there is the possibility of strong winds, you must attach non-flammable guy ropes to the chimney to stabilise it - NO, you can't do this once the fire is burning!
  • DO NOT LEAVE IT UNATTENDED
    • someone MUST be awake at all times while it is burning - if the tent is closed ,it will consume oxygen and there is a risk of carbon monoxide poisoning and of course, there is a risk of fire.
    • ie. you MUST stay awake until the fire is out!
  • CONSIDER a kerosene heater for when the wood stove goes out to keep you warm for longer
    • YOU will need to optimise air flow to keep it ventilated BUT avoid strong winds or strong drafts and it must be > 1m away from flammable material AND it should be turned OFF before going to sleep!
  • a 2600W paraffin/kerosene heater stove on full output will use 250mL paraffin/kerosene per hour and maintain a OneTigris Rock Fortress Tent with doors closed but some ventilation at around 20degC when outside temperatures are minus 1-2degC - see Youtube and when on full output, they are smokeless, tasteless, and allegedly safe - no carbon monoxide issues noted but ensure you do have an alarm and meter!
    • these designed for indoor use to heat 18 sq.m are 32.5×32.5x45cm and weigh ~5kg empty and can hold just over 5L kerosene which should give 18hrs heating on full.
    • the protective cover on top can be removed to allow use as a stove to boil water.
    • kerosene is $AU22/4L which means $1.40 per hr
    • WARNING: whilst most kerosene heaters are designed for homes, they do need some ventilation as they use oxygen and do produce some CO (especially if oxygen levels are running low such as in small enclosed spaces) and they do produce a LOT of water vapour (just over 1L water vapour for every 1L kerosene burnt!). They should be lit outside until the initial odour is gone and they NEED wick maintenance.
  • or, a LPG/butane gas stove/heater with the doors open
    • a small 2000W one weighs 550g, is 12x20cm and uses 100g/hr LPG or 80g/hr butane and designed to heat 5 sq.m
  • or an LPG or propane radiant heater with the doors open
    • Companion LPG 3.6kg heater gives max 10,800 BTU/hr = 3200W
    • Gasmate 5kg heater gives max. 13.5MJ/h = 3750W and uses 265g/h LPG
  • or if you want the tent closed, you can pump hot air into it:
    • but perhaps NOT with the underpowered Companion AeroHeat Lithium Tent Heater has a 4hr 12V Li battery using 60W power for the fan and a 600W gas air heater via 468g propane cartridge will last 9hrs or can use LPG

Lightweight (2-4kg) nylon tents for hiking

  • the lightest hiking titanium wood stoves with chimneys are around 3kg THUS tent plus stove plus axe/saw MAY be too heavy for longer or more strenuous hikes
    • in winter you don't need an inner mesh tent which saves tent weight but still, some may wish to consider an even lighter tarp instead of a hot tent!
    • NB. NONE of these are freestanding - if you want freestanding then you will need the heavier dome tents or some of the larger tunnel tents
    • NB. these have a relatively low stove jack and thus you won't be able to use a chimney oven
    • 2-4P 3.6m diam x 2.05m height 4 season 40D 3000mm silnylon 10 sided teepee tent; packs to 50x20cm; 2.4kg;
    • single door opens to awning; snow skirt; $US229;
    • opt. crescent shaped inner mesh tent150D Oxford floor; 2.7kg $US179
  • OneTigris Ironwall Hot tent:
    • great true 4 season hike tent for a small stove
    • 3.1m long x 1.8m/1.5m wide x 1.3m tall includes 1m long floorless vestibule for stove and wood;
    • 40D 3000mm PU ripstop silnylon outer with ceiling vents
    • removable 2.1m long x 1.65/1.3m wide full fabric inner tent has three No-See-Um mesh + fabric doors and 40D 3000mm PU ripstop silnylon bathtub floor which has buckles on each corner to attach to outer
    • 3 x 8mm alloy poles; 3.8kg; a bit heavy for hiking but may be OK for short hikes;
  • Pomoly Locomotive 3 Chimney tent
  • Amazon also sell some small tipi tents from the US with fire retardant stove jacks for the flue
    • Danchel Outdoor Hot Tent
      • 3.2m diam, 1.6m centre pole; no inner mesh, no floor; 210T polyester; 3.6lb; white; $AU188;
    • Vilemoon 3P Tipi white teepee
      • 3.2m diam, 1.6m centre pole, 3000mm 210T polyester; double doors, no inner mesh or floor; 4lb;
    • Preself Model T2 4P teepee style ;
      • 3.9m x 2.2m tall; only 20D and single zipper on zips; no inner mesh; 2.7kg; packs to 45.97 x 14.73 x 13.46 cm; $AU328;

us03-imgcdn.ymcart.com_48281_2022_08_14_5_d_5dfedb32e5e36b4e.jpg

Pomoly Stove Hut 20

us03-imgcdn.ymcart.com_48281_2021_11_01_a_b_ab7389e472171922.jpg

Pomoly Stove Hut 70 2.0

us03-imgcdn.ymcart.com_48281_2022_12_16_8_e_8ea8d94f6cd69f77.jpg

Pomoly Leo 2 2P hot tent

us03-imgcdn.ymcart.com_48281_2024_01_16_d_2_d27485e1fe373176.jpg

Pomoly Locomotive 3

4-8kg larger 4 season hot tents with 2P inner mesh tent

  • NatureHike Massif tent
    • 3.6m long x 2.3-2.1m wide x 1.45m tall;
    • assymetric 3 doors, 1 as an awning with mesh layer, others are dual mesh/fabric layered doors - one is a smaller rear door;
    • 70D ripstop nylon 3000mmWH ; snow skirt;
    • floorless tent with stove jack (located at rear, close to mesh tent) and a detachable 2P mesh ?2.3×1.35m 2 door frameless inner tent with bathtub floor
    • 4 oversized, heavy (looks like 11mm diam?), color coded aluminium poles which pass through long sleeves should have excellent wind resistance
    • 13 pegs but you really need 20; 6 guy ropes;
    • states 4kg but measured at 4.5kg - too heavy for hiking unless sharing load with another person; packed size: 52x23x17cm (20.5*9*6.7“)
    • https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU2UdmPMF3I - initial thoughts by The Outdoor Review
      • having the awning up means rain will run into the entrance of the tent and pool on the awning - an additional tarp helps address this and add wind protection to the awning area
      • vents leaked and need additional seam sealing
    • compared to the Pomoly Leo 2:
      • the Massif is heavier, stronger, more wind proof and has much larger vestibule / stove area which allows space for small chair and small table as well as stove
      • easier to set up as the 3rd and 4th poles are added after it becomes freestanding which is a major advantage over the Leo 2 which is a bit cumbersome which requires the 3 poles to be passed through their long sleeves prior to erecting
      • stove positioning allows more radiant heat to pass to you in the inner tent whilst still being relatively accessible from the inner tent
      • mesh doors to the vestibule for improved mosquito protection whilst in the vestibule
      • but lacks various advantages of the Leo 2 which has:
        • large fabric parts of the inner tent for warmer sleeping
        • awesome dual doors for the inner tent for versatility in privacy / ventilation and temperature control
        • better access to the stove door for stoking the fire
        • more compact footprint
    • the disadvantages compared to the Leo 2 could largely be addressed by replacing the inner mesh tent with a full fabric dual layered door inner tent such as the Vidalido Land Yu 2Persons TC Cotton S-T139 Tent making a total weight of ~7.5kg - assuming it fits!
    • personally, I prefer the many advantages of the Dokicamp Unlimited Works dome tent VAST-SK100 (50% more floor space, standing height, 5 doors with option of 3rd zip on layer as clear TPU for visibility whilst it is cold and wet) combined with a Vidalido Land Yu 2Persons TC Cotton S-T139 Tent but this combination is more expensive, heavier (15kg but given that you wouldn't be hiking with the Massif, the weight difference is much less an issue), a bit more bulky, a bit more difficult to set up, and may not be as wind tolerant for very strong winds as it is much taller and poles may not be as strong

m.media-amazon.com_images_s_aplus-media-library-service-media_4eddcd50-02d1-476a-a825-7879e20d681c._cr0_0_1464_600_pt0_sx1464_v1_.jpg

NatureHike Massif 2P tent

ae01.alicdn.com_kf_s2a8e57602841439199df122ed4d7d824w.jpg

  • Ankhiale Outdoors Zeta 1 geodesic hot tent
    • 5 pole freestanding geodesic design with TPU door on vestibule section which has a low stove jack
    • 145x 234/155cm x127cm 68D 210T 600mm PU poly (2000mm floor)
    • 2P inner tent; poles are 1/2” and 3/8“ aluminium;
    • partial secondary ceiling fly
    • silver mylar inner lining;
    • Four upper and 2 sidewall vents
    • 8kg;
      • seam tape seems to have peeled off the mylar inner surface on 1st use

img1.wsimg.com_isteam_ip_599ee240-0d82-44a1-9d5d-473dd93ef9a9_img_4388.jpg

Zeta 1

Mid-weight 3-5kg nylon tents with optional inner tents

www.onetigris.com_media_wysiwyg_products_ce-yzp10_4-1.jpg

OneTigris Rock Fortress teepee style Hot Tent

larger car camping tents

  • this group, especially the large floorless tunnel tents are my recommendations for the best car camping hot tent

ae01.alicdn.com_kf_s0099bad2dc0b42b198744837cf1bb443v.jpg

Mobi Garden Guan Tu V (On The Road V) hot tent / gazebo

polycotton or terylene/cotton T/C canvas tents

modular low profile stealth bell Arctic hot tents

  • Savotta Hawu 8 Tent
    • made in Finland/Estonia;
    • fabric is fire retardant, breathable, waterproof 30% PPAN (plasma polymerized acrylonitrile / modacrylic), 30% CLY (Lyocell semi-synthetic cellulose), 40% PVA (polyvinyl alcohol) - 290g/m2
      • fibers in the fabric swell up when moist to provide an effective seal against rain without the need for waterproof and poorly breathable coatings
    • can set up around a tree without need for the optional centre pole and giving aerial coverage from the canopy (if the branches don't fall on you), or, it can be hung from a line of rope attached between two trees.
    • modules (each module could be set up by itself with a pole - two for the extension piece alone):
      • Hawu 8 Door Piece 6kg $AU1865 the door allows you to step down into the tent, instead of having to crawl under a low side entrance, an internal free hanging wall keeps the warm air from escaping from inside the tent when the zippered door is open and a steel stove pipe port with a hinged cover is located between the door and tip of the front piece; peak can be opened or closed; In addition there are two zippers from the apex which enable a rapid exit or to open up that segment; Used alone it forms an open half bell tent;
      • Hawu 8 Wall piece 5kg $AU1465
      • Hawu 8 extension piece 4.5kg $AU1465
      • telescopic centre pole 70cm to 184cm 1.4kg $AU155
      • FDF10 ground sheet 4x4m octagonal 600D polyester 6.5kg $AU475
    • Door + Wall gives 4m diam octagon and 1.7m high and 13sqm floor space
    • additional extension gives 5.5m x 4m x 1.7m high and 19sqm floor space
    • if you want two doors looks like you can buy two of them instead of a wall piece but tat adds to price and an extra 1kg
    • optional groundsheet, telescopic centre pole, pegs

insulated winter ice fishing tents

Vertical wall cube tents

  • these offer the maximum head room to walk around in but may not shed snow as well
    • summer and winter capability for 3-5 people
    • 3.5m from a corner to opposite wall; 2.06m tall;
    • packs to 78.74” х 11.81” х 11.81” 68lbs / 31kg;
    • outer awning Oxford 300 PU 4000; inner layer Oxford 210 PU 2000;
    • 2 entrances each with 3 layers - outer awning, mosquito net and inner awning
    • four 5-layer windows for ventilation as for door but plus a frost-resistant clear PVC layer
    • detachable floor zips to inner layer above ground level (optional heat-insulated 3-layer floor prevents snow melting beneath the tent from the stove and keeps the tent interior warm extra $US499)
    • $US2169
australia/tents_hot.txt · Last modified: 2024/04/09 01:08 by gary1

Donate Powered by PHP Valid HTML5 Valid CSS Driven by DokuWiki